Change my View: Generation Zero is over

General Discussion
41

Not long ago I read an article about heads and tails.
The obviously best example for a chance of 50%. One coin, two sides. It has a long history and is still used for making official descitions, like in soccer.
You’re saying that you flip the coin and most times you make the right call. Well, for 50/50 there should be no “most times”, and that’s what has been scientificly proven in the article by making over 250.000 tests. In real the top side of the coin has a higher chance.

And still, a chance is just a chance and no guarantee.

That’s something I’ve had to learn for every game in the past 30 years, too. And, you don’t know what’s in the code behind that.

  • Is there a bad luck protection? (Guaranteed success after a certain number of fails)
  • is it calculated with absolute or rounded values?
  • if second, which rounding rules are used?

I know, the expectation when seeing values of chances may be different, often depend on the context and tend to round up or down for creating something like a guarantee for our mind, because that’s what we humen always want. Therefore we’re easily disappointed if we fail.

I agree. I’ve always been guessing that the programming of the player detection was created in a way that didn’t evolve like the game did… And maybe even doesn’t allow to be changed in a way needed. Or would require great work deep in the basement of the game.

The game started with just us and the swedish machines. The machines have three different states. Idle, searching, in combat.
If they are in combat, they in general immediatly know where you are. Why? Because there is a reason that triggered the status like seeing you, being attacked or being alerted by other machines. That’s simple for just two factions.

But then there came another faction, the soviets. Great, more machines, and everyone fights every different faction… The problem is, that the system of the player detection wasn’t changed, too…

So, for example, if a swedish machine is being shot at, it still just goes in combat and therefore knows where the player is. No matter, who shot at it.

Do you know what I mean?

That’s the problem of this kind of an evolving game. There is no great 5-year-plan for developing the game and its contents for GZ.

There is the basic game they did finish and a backlog of ideas (partially from the devs themselves, partially from the stakeholders/the community) that could be added. They pick some ideas that might fit, check if and how it’s possible to add them, make a roadmap for some sprints, go through each sprint to realize the ideas, evaluate them, and then go into the next sprint.

There is no final goal for the game in total… Just for every single sprint.

At least, that’s how I imagine the development of GZ based on a scrum-system.

But sadly that also means, even if a sprint seems to be succesful for itself, there can be previous code that doesn’t interact with the newly added one perfectly… And that means: bugs, crashes, balancing or performance issues or other issues which require additional sprints to identify and solve them, if even possible.

Well, it’s always a multiplayer game, no matter if you play alone or with others. There are no different modes. And that’s why there is no pause function. It’s like playing Call of Duty or Counterstrike just against bots. I don’t know how to explain it in a better way… For me it’s just logical.

:rofl: that would be great, although we’ll never see that for this GZ. Would be cool for a sequel.
Btw, me and my GZ-mates already did play couch-coop with GZ. 3 PS5 plugged into one Beamer that is able to show up to four inputs.

42

This thread is 3 years old. I think time has proven the OP wrong. So time will prove rick wrong too.

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43

Everyone may have an own opinion.
But finally GZ and its development and evolution just can be understood after following it a few years, not just a few month.

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One way I should have put it for hacking chance. Okay picture this, The big robot with the two legs, It says 50% chance. I hack it about 9 times and finally I get it. The next right after, takes me about 7 tries, then the next takes 10 tries and maybe if I’m lucky (usually I’m not) I’ll get the next one less than 3 tries. Does that sound like 50% odds? And exactly for soccer! (I’m surprised you brought that up) I’ve been in soccer ever since grade school, had to stop after my injury in high school and now I don’t play, but yeah. Most times more than half the amount of times, we made the right call. My friends and I still do coin flips for dares or to determine who going to be the supplier for a party or something and never once I’ve been calling the wrong side for multiple times preferably 9 times in rows after that!

This game however, the hacking does this.
I hack the same bot that has 50% hack chance and it takes around 9 times, then the very next one takes about around 9 times, then the next and the next after that. And yes, sometimes I’ll get one with a single hack and the next with a single hack Very very rarely though, not as often as I fail. Like what I’d expect is an even amount of fails and wins but I failed the 50% chance maybe 200% more than I succeeded. I get a hack on first or second or even third attempt only sometimes but most of the times I fail the 50% odds, don’t know why.
I don’t know if it’s a bug or the hack thing is bogus. It feels like the 50% is actually a 13% that’s all I’m saying. And maybe I shouldn’t have used the 50% chance hack as an example. The 75% chance seems kind of consistent, it could take about maybe a few tries or maybe more than that if I’m unlucky, the ratio is consistent, I have way more succeeded hacks than the failed attempts for 75%. And the 50% chance let’s say I have 200 hacks in total and about only 40 times I succeeded in the hacks and the remaining 160 attempts are all fails. That’s usually what happens to me. A true 50% odds out of 200 hundred attempts would roughly meet in the middle at ~100 succeeds/fails

Yeah 50/50 chance is 1 out of 2 but in this game makes it feel like I’m hacking a 1 out of 10 for a 50% I hack the same bot over and over and most of the time it takes me ~9 times, doesn’t make sense.

I kinda don’t want to ask my Calculus 3 professor, especially in front of all my colleagues, and about the game too… but I’m pretty sure he’d say the odds don’t match up since it’s consistently giving me fails far more than successful hacks. It’s a video game I shouldn’t care so much, but it’s like the only one I’ve been playing for a while. I play some other games like Pokémon, Mario party, Don’t starve together but even in Pokémon there are lots of odds a random number generator governs that game and I don’t get bs 50% odds in that. The game that I put the most hours in though is GZ with almost 350 hours or maybe Pokémon (I don’t know how to check), but one thing that makes me upset is I’m the only one in my friend group that plays GZ even though it’s free on ps with ps+ they won’t play it with me cause they don’t like the game, I don’t know why I tried reassuring them plenty not even my cousin he said he hates the game and he didn’t even play it for more than 20 minutes. Not enough time to discriminate against the game I’d say._.

Anyways sorry for typing your eyes out I like to vent about things I say is bs.
Plus an opinion is just an opinion too. I don’t know about programming or anything upon that matter I’m in college not for programming I’m in it for another reason entirely. After high school I did get into programming and cloud computing and Linux but it was too boring.

I’m not here to prove myself right, I’m trying to see if my game is bugged or if my luck with hacking is garbage in the game. I was thinking others would tell me their hacking ratios. Plus I don’t use game social medias or anything I don’t know how to create a thread or go on another thread.

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Im not trying to make this a right or wrong situation, I’m just stating my odds, plus I don’t use game social media platforms either. I don’t know how to create a thread or go to another thread or just talk to others about their odds either. Plus everyone has a right to an opinion.

But one thing I am right about is the bug situation, I get stuck in places quite frequently, just like there was this jet I had to go in and I got stuck in it so I restarted the game.
Most times I press triangle it goes to quests and rids me of my ability to hack or quick swap weapons, and now starting this morning, there is something wrong with the gui when looting I think that’s what it’s called. But yeah. I don’t know how the game is on pc I don’t play pc games, I only play ps5 and Nintendo games, mostly the old ones. I started this game a while back on ps4 like around when Covid started but I didn’t play too much until the beginning of the Russia-Ukraine war, and how do I change threads?

Never mind I found it, it’s hard cause the top of my phone is cracked

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46

from past readings hacking has always been a bit of a topic cause of problems. maybe try a different build style and see if that improves your gameplay. one dynamic shouldn’t ruin a whole game for you.

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It’s a love hate situation for me, I hate the hacking odds I have, but I love watching them murder each other.

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I stated a fact and pointed out the odds are against you. sorry if it offended you in any way.

And I don’t do console but the odds my be better that the older consoles would not be supported by games like Gen Zero and therefore the game would be over for those that are still trying to play on them.

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No worries bro, I don’t get offended to easily but I hate making people mad.
A fact about what exactly though? I hope I don’t make you mad though bro. I’m not sure what you’re on about, is it the hacking or the bugs that I’m wrong about? Or are you saying that time will make my odds better? I was just stating my odds, not if I’m right or wrong. I don’t exactly get what you meant and if you don’t do console then it’s natural for you to not know how console version of the game works, people on the console will know how it functions with the bugs they could possibly be different on different platforms, again I’m not too familiar with games. I don’t play too much games so I don’t play computer (although I have seen some cool horror games on pc, that’s one reason I like this game too, it makes my cheeks clench when one of those huge robots chase you) so I don’t get that luxury of playing on a computer however mine I just have so many projects for class on… I know that computer gets things first and games are usually tested better on computers more probably. All I was saying was my odds on console. Sorry again, I should be way more descriptive.

I try to be nice when I speak and such I have had times where people blew up at me even though I didn’t mean it in any way bad or like in an attacking matter so I’m sorry to all of anyone gets mad at what I say, and originally I thought you were saying I was incorrect about the bugs so that’s why I disagreed cause I’m telling you my guy, the bugs I experienced for a long while haven’t been fixed on console yet, like the whole triangle button messing up and going straight to quests instead of quick changing weapon or hacking.

I’m not trying to be mean again I’m a pretty mellow and chill man so yeah. I feel bad, sorry again if I do make people mad at my opinions. Uhm but yeah, my experience on console is like this, sorry I should be more descriptive about stuff.

Also have you read the Electric State? It’s soooo good!

And I know that the odds are against me, they always have been against me, every time I hack them bots I get the bad hacking my guy, can you believe that!? 50% chance of hacking and most times out of all times I hack I don’t get the hack, when it should be almost even of hits and misses.

And don’t worry again man, your response wasn’t offensive in ANY way, you’re good bro. You didn’t use any offensive terms or language or anything man!

50

That’s not how it works for GZ. That would be the case with a bad luck protection… A system that grants you guaranteed success after too many fails.

Otherwise… Who says that it doesn’t work correctly?
50% chance for success out of 1.000.000 tries still can mean that you may fail 500.000 times in a row before you have success… 500.000 times in a row.

That’s what I meant somewhere above. False expectations.
For GZ it doesn’t count the number of trials to calculate whether you have success or not. It’s throwing the dice each time again. And it’s probably not just the numbers 0 to 49 on the dice that may cause a fail, but each between at least 0.00 and 49.99.

We don’t know exactly.

Please, use hacking darts which have a 100% chance or stop hacking and start fighting the machines with your own guns :wink:

51

Why hacking darts? Doesn’t it feel like using hacking darts feel like it’s waste of buying the hacking specialization?
And also generation zero was used to be that you have to be strategic, not an pointless normal PvE game.

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Yes, you may be right. Just a hint for ways to get out of frustration.

Well, the skill system is one of the oldest systems of GZ that hasn’t been changed yet, but these changes are announced for this year. So let’s see what comes next month and maybe then hacking is an option with better odds.

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I’ll give them a try, I need to purchase that mini dlc first, I have some other dlc’s but I don’t have the one with the hacking darts.
Also thanks for tryna get me to understand how the odds work, and having quite the organization when you reply.
My old english 101 teach woulda loved you, he was always on my behind for how I wrote, I was always lazy in English literature and stuff like that.