Well I have been very lucky with regards to bugs, I haven’t actually had any that are game breaking or really detrimental to my enjoyment of the game.
I just hope that all the people who are raising the negative points regarding bugs, are also posting them as actual bug reports as well, so that they can be fixed and are addressed quickly.
I would also like to say, at least give them time to roll out an actual patch. As I’m sure you have all seen the same point rinsed over and over again on the forums.
After that I am confident, given their communication so far have been very transparent, that they will fix a large majority of the problems people are facing.
And no, applications aren’t games but you have a way better handle on how challenging it can be to turn something big out with a small team than most. Thank you for taking the time to reply to my post, and I really hope they fix the issue you have been having in the next patch so you can have as much fun as some of us are.
Also someone said it’s worse than the release of Fallout 76, well that’s not really the point I was making. The point was the team working on Gen 0 is around 20, the team who worked on Fallout 76 at Bethesda Game Studios Austin was around 400 people. And the fact 20 people have turned out a game that imo I enjoy way more than a game made by 400 people is impressive.
Which aspect of management would be to blame for letting the game launch around other triple A titles? Because I’m certain they’ve had a negative impact on GZ’s sales. I would have easily paid double the price if GZ had these bugs fixed prior, and released later.
The only way I found to survive on solo without driving myself nuts on restocking is only fight enemies when it’s part of a mission, and always use a medium+ sized building to survive, otherwise I’ll get shot, exploded, clipped, or hit through the walls.
I’d honestly be surprised if the majority of the bugs reported weren’t already on the devs’ bug list at the time of launch. These aren’t hidden bugs that you need to search for. They’re pretty overt and easy to find for the most part. You just have to play the game. Some of the more obscure ones related to missions when you play coop are a bit harder to find, but it just takes a few sessions of playing coop as a guest vs host before they become pretty apparent.
@Crunchmeister, did you seriously have to rebut a 7 day old post? I’m not even sure where to start with this one.
That post is a 7 day old Call to Arms. A Call to Arms against circumstances that largely no longer obtain.
My comments about the press were largely a self-indulgent rant. The reviews from the ‘gaming’ ‘journalists’ (and I use both of those terms very loosely), were invariably:
The game is too hard - seriously?
The game is too empty - the idiots never left the Archipelago. Imagine them up north, creeping across a field with no cover because there’s five T3 Hunters moving along the road to the left and a T3 Harvester with its four T3 Runner escort in the woods to the right; and
All the buildings look the same - yes, this was a fair point. I would have went for a smaller (but not condensed) map with a bit more asset variation. They could have then opened up new areas with new assets (in the form of local flavour) as DLC.
But in this circumstance I find myself in defence of the journalists. Judging from the YouTubers and Twitch Streamers that (despite being actual gamers) also failed to find any early bugs (even though many were playing co-op - the Russian Roulette of Generation Zero), it seems that in pre-release, the game was far more stable. So it seems the devs broke something important in their efforts to get it out the door.
Of course, quests would still have been broken, assets would still have been floating in the air or clipped into the wall or ground and containers would still have been unreachable. So no matter what, this game wouldn’t have been released in a pristine state.
But back to the other main reason for the Call to Arms:
The state of the forum at the time… Well, feel free to dig through old posts if you want to see childish, self-entitled tantrums from teens and adults. Worst of all was the constant repetition. Why post your concerns (usually in the most dickish language and tone they could come up with), in another topic, when you could start your own? So, we had topic after topic of:
This game is frakked,
Plz patch now; and
Devs respond!
The total value of which was zero.
No doubt the devs were already feeling terrible as the bug reports rolled in; recording a litany of failures. I imagine for most, their stomach acid was churning as they read (or heard their colleagues read), those posts. Some were probably even heartbroken; and for what?
Not one of those topics or posts changed a god damned thing.
The devs are unable to turn back time after all. The moment the bug reports started rolling in, they started identifying issues and fixing them. The community leaders kept the playerbase advised, but in their haste to denigrate, the whingers buried those threads.
So at the end of it, those people were left with the exact same choices they had at the start:
Get a refund,
Shelve the game and wait for patches,
Help the community and devs by providing bug reports and feedback; or to
Simply shut the fuck up and play the game.
Which brings us full circle back to @Crunchmeister’s original post. Most of it is a whinge. It’s an eloquent whinge. It’s a well-reasoned whinge. But it is, nevertheless, still a whinge; and it helps no-one.
So simply ignoring the four paragraphs in the middle, we’re left with some constructive comments:
Both true. The inventory management system drives me nuts, and the skill tree is the weirdest thing I’ve seen in ages; and that’s just two examples. If you have some ideas on how the game mechanics or robot varieties can be improved, start a new thread or find one that’s similar over in Feedback.
As for this last point:
(Emphasis mine)
You’re assuming that they’ve found the major problems.
The quest guy might be chasing down bad triggers because the multiplayer guy is still stumped as to why everything is going to shit on his end.
Anyway, I’ve spent an hour on this on-and-off, and the following posts, at a glance, seem to simply be a repetition of your own arguments and/or more whinging, so I’ll sign off.
The repition, as you articulately pointed out is by nature a form of whining. I’m unsure if you referred to my whining, which I will admit is what is because I unfortunately paid the $40 and can’t receive a refund. My ethos in all of this complaining, although I can’t speak on behalf of others, is to light a fire. I hope that by constant whining they’ll shut us up by providing what was paid for. I’m tired of feeling as though my time was wasted on a game that I have high hopes for just so the org runs away with our money. Not trying to be presumptuous, moreso cautious. If you don’t ask you will definitely not receive. Kudos to your civil retorts.
To be honest, I wasn’t going to respond at all. But I always feel the tiniest bit guilty when somebody writes a response like that and I ignore it. Plus, he was completely civil and had well-reasoned points; I just found them pointless.
You might very well have a point. The squeaky wheel gets the grease, after all. Ultimately, all anybody can do is decide for themselves what course they’re going to take. For me… Well, it hasn’t even had its first patch yet; and if the game is still a mess afterward? Well, I think Iron Rain comes out tomorrow and Rage 2 next month. I’ll come back to GZ later.
Not all presumptions are bad. After all, if you presume the worst in life, everything else is a pleasant surprise.
But I hear you, mate. In regards to Kickstarter and Early Access games I’ve been far too generous with my wallet over the years. Even Julian Gollop’s Phoenix Point, which I backed years ago, is now becoming an Epic Games timed exclusive. Ugh.
Re. Their claim that this game should get a pass on the absurd grounds that we don’t realize how hard games are to make.
Firstly, I really enjoy this beautiful, atmospheric and buggy game… and I will be sticking with it to see where it goes…
…But it’s a bit odd to complain that faults as big and frankly obvious as (insert bug of choice here) are okay because we are too unaware to realize the difficulty of such an endeavor.
Do you accept such excuses anywhere else in life? Because I would love to sell you a motorbike. If it’s faulty I’m sure you’ll accept the excuse that bikes are quite complex.
Okay I apologize for being facetious but I’m highlighting the problems inherent in anecdotal references in debate. So let’s look at the law shall we.
Products shall be fit for purpose and as advertised (this includes reasonable expectations) at time of sale.
Yes I’m paraphrasing but Europe, N America, Asia and most other countries, states, regions and territories have some version of this and so, shouldn’t that be the final word on what any purchaser should be forced to shut up and just accept?
Again I love this gorgeous game. Yes it’s too damn hard playing solo and the devs actually want to make it even harder, the inventory is a dog’s breakfast which would be laughable in a game from the nineties, enemies can spot you from so far away that anything other than a long rifle is useless as if I try to get close enough to use anything else I end up swarmed by a dozen robots who can all kill me in two or three hits! and they can sense me though concrete walls dozen’s of feet underground… But still I love it. The bleak loneliness of it is compelling. The time I first crested a ridge and was greeted by a vast and wholly unexpected snow-blanketed vista I knew I was dealing with some seriously artistic talent and genuine devotion… And I’m hooked, on the whole concept.
But it’s simply not good enough to say the job is hard. Everyone’s job is hard, or dangerous, or dull and perhaps even demeaning, but that’s how we earn the money to buy games so should we not be allowed to expect a finished game when we’ve done our part in handing over the agreed amount of cash?
So with the caveat that I’m happy to stick with ZERO I certainly will not give a pass to ANY business or industry that might decide that selling unfinished products can become a standard practice rather than the occasional errant aberration.
Again, I love Generation Zero and am happy to see my purchase as support for the game.
Initially I was focused and invested in this atmospheric adventure. Then I couldn’t complete missions, safe houses stopped unlocking etc. I became frustrated and decided I could not play properly any more.
I have decided to stop playing until the bugs and glitches have been sorted, because I have faith in the developers (please don’t dissapoint me🙏)
You know how I know this game is good? Usually I would have been angry, pissed and traded the game in to make as little lost financially as possible. But for some reason I have not with this game (developers have cast a spell on me) because I can see the potential.
I have seen many good suggestions in the forums, and if a few were to be implemented then I see Generation Zero being a success.
I don’t think anyone has said “stop b****ing, don’t you know games are hard to make”. For looking back on the thread, and what I have personally said, is that this isn’t a studio with a AAA budget and 300+ staff working around the clock on everything with a huge QA team behind them. This is a passion project, funded by the studio itself (a rarity in this industry) and only has a staffing compliment of around 20 people.
No one is saying you shouldn’t have issue with the bugs. But that said, the point is, this is a very very small team with a small budget, and what they have done so far is very impressive. When it comes to bugs and improvements, give them more time than you would a AAA, give them a little more latitude, ensure you are giving clear, concise, and polite feedback using the bug reporting system (I really hate people who b***h about bugs but don’t actually bother to report them correctly).
Yes there are bugs, no it’s not a perfect game in anyway.
But give them time, and also give them respect for turning out Gen 0 even in its current state, as that is a huge achievement.
I know im a bit late, but with all the crap AAA’s have given use latly. I have to say this is better then any ive played for about last 2 years. All AAA’s want is to microtrans you to death. This game may have problems but sofar they are getting taken care of.
I’m absolutely enamored by this game and am crushing on the devs SO hard for creating this absolute gem of a game.
There are bugs to be sure, but I’ve yet to encounter a crash (on console) or a progression blocker. And while there are less impactful bugs, it’s not even a death by a thousand cuts problem. It’s not polished. But it’s playable. And FUN.
Anyone saying this game should have been held back is missing the point. This is a released product that brings in money and funds continued development. It shipped complete enough, and is getting better with every release.
Proper respect to Avalanche for creating a game that is utterly true to the vision and was delivered as advertised. Where else will you campaign a guerrilla war against man-hunting machines set in post-wall 80’s Sweden?
I say good job, here’s my money, keep improving the game, and give me ways to throw more money at you.
Must agree with @sk_moose. I was intrigued by the game when it was first announced, but bought it close to the June update. That might have spared me from the initial pain others have experienced. So except for a few mission glitches and other minor stuff, the game has behaved well on Xbox. It wasn’t expensive compared to similar titles (IMHO) and I’ll eagerly take any improvements that Avalanche throw in for free in future updates. And if they ask for money for more content in future expansions, I’m sure that I’ll pay.
To each there own on pain and misery. Try breaking your spine. I think that’s pain even a prego woman wouldn’t take. But besides physical pain I didn’t quite understand why some were so hard up about the games beginning; which that’s due to the fact I went through the hardship with COTW day 1 full release. Haha my only gripe was some of the weapons physics weren’t right, still aren’t but I massive enjoy it though. But keeping my lips shut from sinking ships with frustrations I bare witnessed to the devs fixing the game, and listening to their fan base. Even though I don’t fan to any just enjoy the few things in life. I was humbled then and I’m just as humbled now watching this title have some issues and being metamorphosed into a prize gem.
Don’t get me wrong ,I’ve had a few games that went south in my book in the past and being my age near 40 I don’t slander anyone to steam like a child. I just go get my refund and tell them I wish them luck in finding those titles and devs I found weren’t my cup of tea. Let bygones be bygones if it’s not working out for you, get your money back if you can. But honestly and respectfully with today’s age follow the game, watch alpha and beta being played. Get their thoughts or get a chance to play beta. Save yourself from anger. Or wait a few months after release… if your the type to go rampage on forums slandering words and making yourself look foolish. Just a word to the few that’s come and gone here.
The thing for me is that the game is still very unpolished and at the rate they update (once every other month) it’s not enough. I play on ps4 and trophies are still glitched, it’s excessively laggy with frame rate dropping under 10 fps more often than not. Lootables are empty, I fall through the map, enemies go through walls. I loved this game once before but the beer goggles have been taken off. Now if they has labeled the game “beta” or “work in progress” we wouldn’t have these complications. But it’s the fact they’re advertising it as a completed game when very clearly it’s not.
People have to pay real money, earned money and sometimes you can’t get a refund.
If you’d consider the fact that a very, very small team of dedicated developers are working on this as their passion project, it’s amazing what they’ve done so far. Of course it’s annoying when things break, and if you don’t like a product then get a refund, but this game doesn’t come close to what a Beta is so please don’t compare the two.
Another very, very small studio had a release date on Lost ember, a game I was looking forward to, 19th of July. But they postsponed it due to a number of bugs that would ruin the full experience. Thats how it should be, respect and definitely a studio to follow ahead.
I really love GZ, but why is’nt it reasonable to expect a game more polished at release than this one was?
Sure, but Avalanche made the call to release anyway. They’ll have to owe up to that decision. As I recall, Half-Life, one of the most popular games ever made came with gamebreaking bugs on launch. You either have to stick to your launch schedule or don’t. Sometimes it works, sometimes not.
I agree the devs should have postponed the launch and rather release it as early access, But that decision has been maid so they just need to go from there.
I for one is really loving the game. Currently have 119 hours into it (about to be more)
But as of right now (28.10.19 right before the October update launched) the only selling points is the premiss of Machines in late 80s Sweden, but mostly because I myself is from Skandinavia and live 28 minutes driving distance from Sweden, so I can understand the language.
It has an semi-interesting story when you get into it, but it takes a very long time to get real interesting.
And it leaves many questions unanswered I guess many will be answered as the game progress with DLCs. But there is one question that bothers me for a long time. ** spoiler warning **
Spoiler
How didn’t the military now about the machines, while it was a project BY the military?
Don’t get me wrong I still love this game and still wish and hope for it to one day be critiqued for what it meant to be.
How it’s left is how people will remember it. So, shall we remember it by the bugs, glitches and crashes, or shall we be patient and let the devs improve and expand on their idea.
