Fix Or Fail... Its up to you


#1

This is my opinion of the game after 14 Hours of exciting / gruelling solo game play. In no way to i feel the developers OWE me ANYTHING. I will be halting my game play in hopes that some major patches come out before i try again.

 

Side note, I have been playing PC video games as long as i remember, 20+ years, starting first with DOOM on the family PC in the living room while listening to the nightly news in the background. Ive seen a lot but i am simply a fan and have never worked in the gaming industry however i do understand how politics / hype and pressure from communities and publishers can effect how a product gets released.

 

Here are a few MAJOR fixes i feel the developers NEED to address. I am sure many of them have been brought up here in the past few days since release. I am simply voicing my own concern to add the the severity of the problems with the game in its current FULL RELEASED state. Remember that, this game has been FULLY RELEASED .

 

Enemy’s phasing through walls . This should have NEVER made it past early beta testing. Honestly this is an alpha issue at best that was never addressed or dealt with, which raises concerns to the tune of, do the developers even care about the game play? Fix the phasing. I don’t know if this is an AI problem or a modelling issue, But it seems to me like the building models are just sort of there, while being restricted to player movement only? another example being that tree leaves still blow through the walls, branches phase through, grass grows through the floor etc. These houses do not feel like real structures.

 

Enemy’s tracking through walls. Walking silently through a house next to a Runner? chances are it will see you through the wall anyway and come right after you. Run away from (any) Machine and hide in a building? Don’t ever try, cause they saw you, and are tracking you through the wall. Running around a mountain / hill / rock face? Nah they saw you, and are probably actually still trying to shoot at you through the earth too! I get that these are advanced robot killers with some (probably) advanced sensing technology. But they should NEVER be tracking me through a wall / STILL trying to attack me through that wall. The FIRST hunter i ever ran into near the castle NEVER stopped shooting at me through the mountain. Constant lasers being fired in my direction, even though i had been out of sight for many minutes. I understand if ONE machine see’s you, they are most likely connected to each other, so ALL of them will see you, but the above mentioned attacking through walls is ridiculous.

 

Lack of loot / randomized loot. I get it, we need to search through these small Swedish towns and search for ammo, guns, health etc… But the SAME house and the SAME backpack with the SAME pair of Binoculars OVER and OVER again is not an exciting way to loot. I would rather loot 100 different containers and find a pack of 9mm than loot 3 tool boxes all containing 1 health pack, 1 set of binoculars, a shirt i already have(which has zero stats by the way) and another backwards baseball cap. Just switch it up a bit, add a few more models, make cosmetics a little harder to find, nobody needs 1000 pairs of binoculars. As soon as you find a scope for your hunting rifle they become useless, which could be in the first 30 minutes of game play really.

 

Secondly, Why have do many buildings we CANT enter. Like that one bar with the green neon sign. Hey THAT building looks new and refreshing, i wonder whats inside? Cant enter because there is no interior. The door is locked, you cant even see through the windows. All those sheds by the water, LOCKED. Why even put them there? This is 2019 having a game like GZ without arguable ALL of the buildings being lootable is a shame, dare i say even lazy on the developers part.

 

Models. This is a HUGE one. I know tons of games re-use assets from previous versions / titles. I find it hard to understand how a developer can think placing the same model back to back to back OVER and OVER again with a slightly different color is a good way to design a world. Sure small town Sweden’s housing is pretty similar, i get it. One guy builds the houses in that town, the same guy probably build the sheds(which are locked to us anyway). But its impossible for all of these houses to be laid out the same inside, TV in the same place, same dishes on the table, i don’t need to go on. Each town might as well be exactly the same, cause they pretty much are. Again dare i say this i just lazy. There is NO way this games testers didn’t bring this up. Ive seen it said before, there is no reason to even loot these houses anyway. Aside from being BORING there isn’t much in there anyway.

 

Weapon switching / Input lag. Often you switch from your health pack / throw able back to your gun, or anything really there is a small window in which it seems none of your keys register. Forcing players to have to mash a key a second time. This is extremely frustrating when in a battle where a split second throw of a flare while needing your SMG back out can make all the difference. Obviously there needs

 

“Questing” I do appreciate having to find my own way in a video game, especially an atmospheric one such as Generation Zero. I would rather not have a quest marker, go here, do this, get paid sort of structure. But GZ has done just that. Go to this house: Find letter, go to (maybe) a second house: Find Radio. MISSION COMPLETE, heres 250xp for your troubles. If i had a REASON to go into these houses ex: a better loot table, there would be no problem. Its almost too tedious to even attempt to care about the story when its the same mission over and over again.

 

Audio. Most of the sounds in GZ are alright, nothing amazing or anything. Audio is tough in a video game. These days we have far better headsets / speakers then even 5 years ago making audio that much crisper and complex then ever before. The…lack of quality audio samples is a concern for me as it breaks ANY immersion i may have accumulated by running through the forest. The ambient nature sounds are pretty damn good, but the lack of consistent footsteps makes me assume i am floating sometimes. Any time you are switching what is in your hands you do not make any sound, other than some rustling of pulling said item out. The guns sound plain, even the magazine drops and locked into place, rather than being their own entity. Example: reload an AK and try to spin around while the mag drops, It is ALWAYS doing to be falling to your right, again breaking immersion. This is minor but its all in the small details that make a good game a GREAT game.

 

Last but not least, the Emptiness. This game is not supposed to be packed with action from start to finish. You are meant to take your time and “explore” the towns and villages hoping to find that rare weapon or attachment maybe a little more ammo or a health pack. With the way the looting system works the game really does feel empty and lifeless. Same house, same loot, same cars etc… It gets old quick.

 

Transparency. With game development becoming easier for indie teams to gather resources and work together, their main tool in fighting back against AAA teams is their ability and willingness to work TOGETHER with their communities to shape their game. We’ve all seen it far to many times when a game gets fully released riddled with bugs and issues and the development team goes silent, even just ditches the game completely. Thanks for your money, this game is shit were done kinda thing. Now i don’t think this is Avalanches mission here, but i HOPE they remain transparent on what they are doing. I understand you cant just pay someone to respond to every message on a form from a passionate and sometimes aggressive communities, but at a bare minimum let us know what you are doing, Have you read these requests? Yes? Are you working on them? Maybe? Do you care enough to admit your failures and promise to fix them? I hope so. I’m not talking about “An Update from the GZ Team” That announcement, while its nice to hear from the developers 48Hrs AFTER a release, its hard to feel this is just a manager doing their best to save some face. Hey guys don’t worry were going work on things ok? just trust us. Heard that before. That is a beta test message at best.

 

I rarely post anything like this so I apologize for being a tad stand off ish and aggressive at times, and in no way do i mean to be rude to anyone on the development team. Everyone has a job to do and they have done a great job so far with this game. I am only voicing my concerns because this game is a FULL RELEASE . Its almost like nobody tested this thing prior to launch. To be honest if i could refund this game in its current state, i would have and moved on with my day but i cant. So i write this is hopes some of you read it and can agree with me that this game is an almost polished beta experience and i hope the team at Avalanche see’s this and has put a plan in motion to remedy some of these concerns many of us have.

 

If you’ve read this far thank you. Again i mean no disrespect to any of the staff for this, i am just very passionate about video games and the current state of this industry can be very frustrating at times. You have all done a good job building this game so far, it just seems to be missing a little too much for me to consider it a full release. As i said above the development team owes me nothing and i expect nothing is return. Just using my voice to hopefuly help this game become amazing.

 

That being said, i look forward into jumping back in and blowing up some jackass Ticks while i run away from Hunters, Runners and Tanks.

 

Good luck in your travels everyone! Thanks for reading.

 

 

 

 

 


#2

AcKsHuAlLy…

There is a feat that lets you loot robots for parts, (and it’s hella overpowered), and that feat, combined with a certain something something you can loot from some robots, do explain why they’re able to track you through walls.
It does not explain why a machine is able to track you through twenty meters worth of rock and concrete inside of a bunker.
It does not forgive robots for being able to melee attack you through a wall.
But it does OPV scanners does adequately explain why certain machines are able to see you through a flimsy wooden wall.

That being said, I agree with most the remained of your write-up. And would like to add one thing:

Inventory management and management of stacks of ammo, first aid packs, are actually implemented poorer than it was in Fallout. Not Fallout 76. Not Fallout 4. Fallout. The one from 1997 which we all love.


#3

Okay I understand what you are saying and the dev’s are on for the fixes and after that you get more stuff, what it will be we will see.

But remember you only paid half the price of an full game and get more stuff than in other games. And sure the game isn’t finished and polished but how should it be? This is the way to make the game right, it’s an unpolished diamond and they use us to make it shine.

The things you have mentioned are pinned on a lot of the players in the steam community. So just wait and maybe help with bug reports and suggestions to make this game greater than now.

And avalanche does a great work to trust before in the hunter game (wich is still supported, patched und getting new dlc) and I trust em. The put after 48 hour an letter for us all, that the will be on the bug fixes and after that the will being more stuff.

But in my case I love the game, so maybe is see it from the wrong side, but for 35€ the game would be in a state i would even play it like it is.


#4

But remember you only paid half the price of an full game and get more stuff than in other games. And sure the game isn’t finished and polished but how should it be? This is the way to make the game right, it’s an unpolished diamond and they use us to make it shine.

This is a problematic statement for me. Sure some bugs will get through, but there are some game breaking massive bugs that should have been found and addressed prior to launch. Ones that have the OP and myself putting the game down and wishing we could refund.


#5

I agree that the price is lower than any AAA title. $39.99CAD for me, not bad really. The point is the game is a “full release” riddled with bugs glitches, multi player errors etc… which i guess is to be expected these days. Its early access at best masquerading under a full release title.

Conspiracy. Consoles don’t have early access as much as PC does(as far as i know, my last console was a ps3) Want more sales, full release to consoles along side with PC. Part of the business management teams job is to account for the massive inrush of purchases countered by the evident refunds and returns. Although most people wont bother going back to the store to return a game, lets be honest.

I am sure Avalanche does great work, it shows so far. But this game is FAR from being a full release.


#6

Thanks for such insightful feedback, we really appreciate you digging into details like this. Feedback received loud and clear! :slight_smile:


#7

that’s a lot to read… in short form what i think happens more often than ever now days is when a REALLY GOOD GAME with high expectations come out with its graphics and gameplay and so forth, alpha stage is getting it to crudely work, beta stage is to get very few selective people (youtubers) to sponsor their game and show what its about and to give feedback to help improve the game before final release, FULL RELEASE is to fine tune the gameplay now that everyone has access to the game and have everyone come together to try and resolve and fine tune a very broken bug.

so far they have fixed a few things since full release, like when you start the game up and for PC users the mouse wouldnt work? they fixed that pretty quickly in my opinion, and im sure they are working very hard to fix other gamer breakers. i have about 30 hours in the game and besides all the crashes and somewhat frustrating enemies phasing through walls and gang banging me to all hell, i love the game, even with the settings all put on low and medium, it still looks REALLY GOOD in my opinion.

moral of this reply, what game doesnt come out with bugs? look at battlefield or call of duty, they came out with bugs and fixed most of them, but still some are unfixable, or just dont want to waste time and money on a little hotfix when the games server are overloaded and crashes, im sure they’re fixing it to be much cleaner and work well now that we have a bigger community to help each other solve problems easier/faster!

idk, it could just be me but you seemed to come off in a bad way right from the title, so i thought id share some input as well. i agree and disagree on some stuff, but failing on a good game like this doesnt seem like much of an option, especially so early on.


#8

We need patch asap on ps4


#9

I agree with nearly everything Runner has said here, with these additions:

Loot: There’s too little too much! That is: why have 5 back packs with 2 bullets in each instead of one back pack with 10 bullets? There should be fewer items to search with more in them.
The looting needs to be consistent with the amount of storage you have. You should be able to expand your back pack further - maybe by finding other bigger packs in the world, or by adding smaller pouches to your belt or something.
Some things need to be more stackable in the inventory. 5 flares per slot?

Models: A bit more variation would really be welcome. Especially in the interiors.
It’s possible the devs will open up the unenterable buildings later - this has happened in the Hunter:CotW where the lodges were all blocks to start with. But yeah, it’d be great to have a few different types of buidlings: shops, offices etc.
Oh And the Safehouses should be SAFE once you’ve gained them! Not have respawning enemies outside every time you fast travel there.

Enemies: I feel some of the enemies are far too agile. The Hunters can leap and turn 180 in mid-air. Surely a big, heavy, metal object couldn’t do this? What the heck are they using for power? And yes, SORT the tracking/phasing through walls thing.

Audio: The only gripe I have about the audio is the footsteps are too “thumpy”. I run over grass and my feet go “hhud, thud, thud” as though I’m the size of an elephant. I get that you want to indicate that the sound of my footsteps (paricularly when running) can alert the enemy, but this is ridiculous!

The Emptiness: Is great. Leave it that way. No NPCs. Some small critters would be great though, beside the birds.

To be clear: I love the game, and I think the devs are doing a great job so far. I simply wish to make the game better for everyone.


#10

Some notes on the loot: I also agree there is far too much. Too many bullets everywhere all the time. For me, the biggest thing that breaks immersion as far looting goes is when during multiplayer we can all loot the same container and it’s different for all of us.I understand it gives everyone on the team a chance to loot everything but it would add so much more to the immersion and the cooperation to have to decide who gets to loot what, swapping items out with each other between whoever is sniper to whoever is assault or medic perhaps. That’s my biggest gripe with loot.

Models: I agree, more internal variation would be nice. The exteriors, in my opinion, are solid (no pun intended). It would be nice to have the buildings you can’t enter opened up, like some of the restaurants and such. @Sharon Glad to hear that CotW was similar and the lodges were eventually opened up, that gives me hope there :slight_smile:. Shops and offices would be nice, maybe a doctors in the town or city, and various other necessities that would be there.

Safe house: Should be safe, I agree with this one.

@Sharon I would think with a proper hydraulic system those bots could potentially make some crazy jumps irl :stuck_out_tongue:


#11

10000% agree. They need to step up their game


#12

love ur game. U guys did a great job. Can’t wait to see it get better.
Thank you.


#13

THEY DO JUMP hunters ( transformer ) Jumped on to balcony of the house i was in and murdered me and me buddy , good job i was wearing me brown pants :rofl:


#14

Here’s a little video. I snuck into a bunker, yet somehow a hunter and multiple dogs were trying to shoot me through the ground and bunker walls. Instantly gave me a headache :slight_smile:


#15

I agree with most of the OP here. I think some points are overly harsh, but not wrong either.

If this were an early access game, I’d be ok with most of those points because the game would be a work in progress. How the hell this got released as a final version with so many game-breaking issues is mind-boggling.

Small bugs that are annoyances or rarely seen / hard to find, I can understand. But these aren’t small, random, or hard to find. These bugs are in your face and game breaking. It makes the game unplayable in come cases as it breaks story progression completely.

Overall, I quite enjoy the game, but it seems every time the pace picks up and I start really having fun, some new game breaking bug rears its head preventing me from progressing further.

And I’m 100% in agreement of the reuse of assets being overdone. There’s only so many times you can see the same 3 cars, 2 barns and 5 houses before being bored to tears. Sure, reuse assets. That’s the way it’s done. But how about creating more base assets to add some variety? The biggest disappointment was arriving at a new town / settlement / farm and seeing a building we haven’t seen before, thinking “Hey, that building looks like it could be important!”, only to discover that it’s nothing but a static set piece that can’t be interacted with. And the ones that can be explored are the same ones we’ve seen dozens of times before, packed with worthless loot that we don’t need. It makes it look like all of Sweden shopped their houses as IKEA vs being a true, varied world.

At the very least though, I’m hoping the major bugs get sorted shortly. I’d love to be able to continue playing, but as it stands, there’s no way I can continue with my mission log bugged out. And when I play with other friends, the host is the only one that gets ammo drops. Guests get nothing. Makes it hard to play coop when no one player has any ammo.


#16

[quote=“metafish, post:10, topic:13428”]
Some notes on the loot: I also agree there is far too much. Too many bullets everywhere all the time. [/quote]

You seem to be lucky there. In any coop game I’ve played so far, the only person that gets ammo in loot drop is the host. Guests get nothing other than .32 ACP and bird shot.


#17

All fair and valid feedback, however, people do need to take in to account that the team developing this is really small. It’s not a AAA game, it’s just fractionally more than an indie game studio wise, and imo they have done amazingly well at turning out this game. Yes there are issues and bugs, but given the studio size, it’s still impressive given AAA developers like Bethesda and Bioware haven’t exactly done any better of late, and I’d far rather play Gen 0 than Fallout 74 or ANTHEM right now.

I think if we give them some time, and more of this very fair and politely worded feedback, then all of these issues will be things that get fixed. I do think a few people do need to remember that there is a human on the other end of these messages however. (Not here, but in other threads).

Hopefully we can get more people on the forums here who are like you guys and actually take the time to provide comprehensive feedback, and then we will have not just a fun sandbox to play in, but a great game (after a few updates).


#18

I agree with a lot of that for sure, but I don’t regret buying the game at ALL. I still get angry seeing PUBG on my games list however :sob: I love the game but it badly needs more house and bunker variety 1000%. When you don’t have people to play with and most people kick you for joining or leave after 5 minutes of joining you, it gets so old seeing the same things by yourself all the time!


#19

Thanks for joining the conversation everyone. I am glad i am not alone in my criticism. One thing that bothers me is the argument that the dev team is small. Thats fine, small dev teams can do great things. Early Access? no problem, they can work on the fixes as intended by the title ‘Early Access’ and we are happy to be a part of the grind. But like i said before, a FULLY RELEASED game shouldn’t have half of these issues. Small dev team or not, thats the major problem here.

My points may seem a little harsh to some, but i think they are justified. I really would like to see this game succeed, or at a very least become playable so i can finish it.

I will be patiently waiting for a response from the dev team about what they intend to fix, if anything.


#20

They posted a bug fixes list yesterday, some like 200+ bugs being worked on right now.