WHAT???
They deleted the Goths???
How? With ease.
And last I checked, I have not made that claim anywhere. If you feel otherwise, [citation needed].
Actually what I’m doing is making a point about genre conventions using examples of narratives that I expect to be sufficiently widely known to be of use here, but OK. 
Are we doing random assertions now?
Let me try one: “If a game gets hard, it becomes too much of a chore. I don’t work for free.” 
(Incidentally, I don’t necessarily mind difficulty. If the premise were, “Look here, there are 12 colossi^Wtanks in this world, they’ll be damn hard to beat, but once you do, the world is free!”, then that’s one thing. But your take seems to be, “I want it to take 2 hours to beat a tank”, while the game world has an infinite supply of them, and I just don’t see myself spending the rest of my natural life in this game. And where’ s the achievement in working hard on taking down a tank when there’s a thousand more of the blighters?
But look at me getting all nuanced while trying to make fun of the broad strokes!)
Seriously though. You’d like the game to be harder. I get it. I got it the first few times you said it. And it’s still fine by me as an optional mode.
I’m more open to that in that context of “that’s what I like” though than that of “because realism.” I don’t want to hear about realism until there is also pooping, permadeath, and losing limbs or eyesight in battle, to name but a few.
But fortunately, it’s not me you’d have to convince, I’m not in charge of this game.
But that’s getting seriously off topic.
This is your personal preference.
I was answering to something else, namely your “I can’t square what I game-play experience with my model of the world.”, to which my answer was in short, “Have you immediately found fault in the experience, or have you considered that the world model may be at fault? Because I can build a world model for myself where I don’t experience cognitive dissonance.”
And that in turn was already off topic from “I want to be a dog pilot.”
I’m afraid I’m just not seeing that as the same achievement you seem to. It’s a bunch of unnamed characters. Cannon fodder. Easy prey. And the machines had the element of surprise to boot, and could presumably order the units around as they liked to gain a strategic advantage.
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I do not say you have, sir. 
Fair enough.
Still, games and movie differ in approach: you do not go bump around in a movie.
Movies are quite brain-dead amusement, compared to a game…
And just this is where I have an issue with the objective of either movie and/or game: One is interactive, the other… not so.
Maybe we should try to find a comparison in games, instead of movies?
THIS!!!
AMEN.
But… not me.
I do not want everything thrown at me, I actually want to work for it, and damn hard too.
OPTIONALLY…
A Hard Mode/Game +, which you can chose at the start.
No, but I do not like that same tank just staring at me, wondering what the hell I’m doing to it. 
These are, I believe, meant to, at least, try and shoot back?
heheheheh
I did say, I even think they will need to nerf both armour and HP if they boost the three points mentioned.
Hell, I do not care if I could one shot the darn thing, if it fought like an exomorph on PCP.
But no… instead, sometimes it just stands there…
OOOOOH.
Darn good suggestions right there!!!
Well…
Soldiers are supposed to be somewhat of a fight.
Otherwise, why have an army?
If farmers can do the same, those would be far more interesting, as they can do farmland jobs out there, thus helping the population, no?
And we get plumbers in the fighter jets, handy in case they are shot at…
Instant repairs on the fly. XD
Unless you’re asserting that “the Joker may seem dead, but will likely return before long” cannot hold true in a Batman game, I’m really not sure what point you’re trying to make.
I feel you’re getting far too hung up on this movie vs game thing. It’s like saying I can’t use two vehicles to discuss color (“one is red, the other is blue”) because it’s somehow invalid to compare the color of a car to that of a motor-bike.
I don’t think anything good could come of this.
If we discussed specific existing armies, before long, someone would likely get offended, and then the mall cops on this board would tase us, bro.
Now discussing the armed forces of the game? That might be interesting, but we don’t really have enough information. I believe at the time, real Sweden had the draft, and uni was free? But here we are with a game world where things are crazy enough that a robot army is commissioned. What does that mean for the make-up of the army? More people in long-term service, fewer inexperienced draftees? Fewer people altogether “because we have the robots now”? It’s really all guesswork until we know how many experienced soldiers there are, how much covert unemployment, etc.
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[quote=“Ennui, post:25, topic:20977”]
Unless you’re asserting that “the Joker may seem dead, but will likely return before long” cannot hold true in a Batman game , I’m really not sure what point you’re trying to make.
[/quote]What I assert here is: you just CANNOT compare game to movie.
You just do not control ANYTHING in a movie, which in game, you do?
A Warhammer GAME is far different from a Warhammer movie, I’d assume.
Same for a Halo Movie to Halo Game?
Well yes, those ingame.
Understand: Hitler there is STILL A THING, and a THREAT.
Hence the Robot Army.
And, well, this not so populated any more populated (since nigh “oblivionated”) army.
Considering the German threat, I would think, these were not just a few lazy bums that used their rifle as a walking stick.
True?
Bro, I just did.
You do realize it’s set in 1989, not 1939, yes?
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I know, which is what I address.
If GZ was a MOVIE it would be totally diffferent.
It would be more like Kill Command.
Incorrect.
It is NOT set in 1989!
It’s set in GZ.
And according to the story… Hitler lives…?
Check the intro.
The intro text states that
“After World War II, Sweden enjoyed an econimic boom from having come unscathed out of the war. But neutrality had come at the cost of integrity, as poor readiness had forced the country to make deals with Hitler”
I can’t even pin this on Swenglish grammar.
Historically, Sweden wasn’t ready for war, and during the the war, they were forced to negotiate with Hitler. Not in 1989.
Sweden’s response to this awkward predicament was to make efforts to be better prepared for the next war. This includes civilian training, and military spending. This is what gives us a population easy to move to bunkers, for our character to be able to identify the business end of a pistol, and for the government to be spending serious money on a slightly bonkers robot army. In the world of Generation Zero, Hitler spent his honeymoon lying dead in a ditch, on fire. He’s not sat in Germany making the best deals with Sweden.
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@Flick
Yes: [quote=“Flick, post:29, topic:20977”]
forced the country to make deals with Hitler ”
[/quote]
IMHO this would state Hitler is still not that very dead in GZ.
Also, several mentioned Hitler alive in GZ Discord.
Shrugs
I for one would love to see a far more elaborate behind-the-screens info, being it ingame, or a post, hell, a book for all I care, explaining the GZ reality: History, technology, economy, porn, religion, state affairs, …
But that is me.
During the war. It’s simple grammar.
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Aye. Doesn’t help that Hitler was born in '89.
He’d be 100.
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@Flick
True.
I interpreted as still kicking.
Well… shuffling around…
@Ennui
People can get old…
Look at Methusalem, 900 + years.
IF implemented:
Suggested Skill Tree:
Mech Programming (1 point)
Mech Technology (1 point)
Mech Physics (1 point)
Mech Hacking (2 points, 1st for Proto, Mili and FNIX, 2nd for Apo)
Mech Possession (4 points: per point 10 min possession or until destroyed, whichever comes first, so 4 points = 40 mins possession)
Mastery Skill: Verum Possessionem (True Possession) (1 point)
10 point tree
As we all know, each Skill Tree comes with 2 skills.
For one I’d like to point to my Pet Master https://forum.generationzero.com/t/machine-master-aka-pet-master/20977 (Hmmm, maybe Machine Possessor would be more correct), and for the other, the Pet Maker (or whatever it’s name will become), I would like to point to another post I cannot find right away.
It comes down to:
First of all… CRAFTING implemented!!!
Right?
No?
Either way:
One has to hunt ALL TYPE CORRECT parts from machines (logically: if you want to make a runner, a Tank Leg would not quite fit, eh?), needs the CORRECT Blue Print*, crafting place and… the needed skill tree.
Once this is all in place, one needs of course the right skill tree, and the right amount of skill points put in the correct skill. (Note, adding these skills does NOT mean increased skill point pool: one will STILL have “only” 30 Skill points to distribute, and as always: choose wisely!, as it works like it is right very now).
Per CLASS of build (Proto, Mili, FNIX or Apo) a skill point is needed in the right skill.
One cannot only make machines… but also UPGRADE existing machines (up to a certain point, and only if he/she has the right components and the needed skill with needed points distributed to it).
To top this off, one can (again with the needed components: in this case the right paint(s) and paint print**) turn his very ‘pet machine’ into a full blown piece of art…
Activating the MASTERY would even “much more furtherther” allow you to attach an Experimental Weapon to your nice, well build and fully potty trained PoA (piece of art)!
However… for that, you will have to have activated all skills to the max (which seems logical).
Once the pet gets killed: you WILL be able to recover the machine (save for truly destroyed parts).
Even damaged parts, which you can repair (percent wise, perhaps, based on your bought amout of skill points?), so the machine is never truly a goner.
Unless of course, a critical hit (which would have a very low chance to get, maybe like 60% (JK lol, 70%)) to occur.
Seriously though, like 1 or even 0.5% chance.
Reason for this: to enable the player to hunt for more parts.
Each player would be able to build 2 of each type so they would have 4x2 (2xTick, 2xRunner, 2xHunter, 2xTank) machines ‘in their garage’ at all times, in case one gets permanently downed.
OR: to swap out if the player is bored of the current one, having a different load-out.
The Tree (suggestion)
Identify Parts (speaks for itself, seems logical) (2 points, 1st for Proto, Mili and FNIX, 2nd for Apo)
Create Mech (speaks for itself, seems logical) (This one has 4 points: 1 for each class existing)
Repair Mech (speaks for itself, seems logical) (2 points: 1st: Proto, Mili and FNIX, 2nd for Apo)
Mech Art (speaks for itself, seems logical) (1 point)
Alter Mech (Remove/Add Mech Parts/Weaponry) (This one has 2 points: 1st for Proto, Mili and FNIX, 2nd for Apo)
Mastery Skill: Experimental Mech (Add Experimental Weaponry) (1 point)
Total points spent: 12 if Mastery is bought.
NOTE: IF in the near future a new class is added, that will NOT affect this skill tree point wise!
It will ‘ever’ be 12…
IF the whole Bot mastery section is taken (both the possession/pet master and the other) a total of 22 points is used.
Gathering Parts:
This is a bit hard to just throw out here.
I was thinking: each part has a 5% chance of dropping, and 1% for being in PERFECT state.
Each Type AND class drops as per the type and class.
Which is just… well… very logical… one would think.
Or is 5% too much?
This would translate to 1 part per 20 machines… if RNG is ‘fair’…
Naturally, you’ll be very fukkered, as RNG NEVER is… MUAAAHAHAHAHAH! 
Mistake made, fixed!
Credits too @Watcher_Eternal for assisting in the creation of this post!!!
1 Like
OH!!!
Idea…
IF you got BOTH trees (thus the whole section) worth 22 skill points, a hidden set feat becomes yours as BONUS:
POSSESS CREATED MACHINE!!!
Thus, the perfect artistic beast you made?
Well, you can BE it now!!!
How about frikken that, eh?
Carpe Frikken Diem, I would say… XD
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I want this so badly
You go into one of the small bunkers where they have been researching machines and on the desk you find a computer floppy disk, which you take. Miles later on another part of the island, you come across a container with one Dog left inside. You insert the disk and the Runner comes alive, but his pipes are blue rather than red and he is now on your side.
He follows you wherever you go and shoots at anything that shoots at you. If you go somewhere he can’t follow, he waits at the door until you come out - even a bunker. Come out of a different door and he sets off after you. Fast travel and he cannot do that, but sets out across country after you until he catches up. You can see him at any time on the map (like you can a visiting player). Also you can send him away by clicking on the map and as well as “Place Marker” it says, “Place marker for Dog”. As soon as you click it, he sets off. He does not engage machines until they engage you. They don’t turn on him, it’s just a bonus, although he can get hit by bullets aimed at you, or by missiles that land near him, so in a heavy engagement you have a choice between having his support or sending him away to a marker point to keep him safe - your call.
He attracts no attention from machines ('cos he’s a machine) and bimbles along beside you, but turns and “points” to any machines he detects. He has only one life and when he’s gone, he’s gone.
For single players it would be the coolest thing in the world. I am willing to beg…
10 Likes
Excellent idea. Ideas like this could keep the game fresh for years to come.
Instead od this I would suggest some kind of repair with scavenged parts… hey, maybe even upgrades
3 Likes