New weapon, new attachment and ammo change

Yeah different rounds would be cool. Hydroshocks, split tips, +p, subsonic… might not do much difference but still would be a trip to see.

Or even adding devices and making your self a custom experimental weapon. Maybe find experimentals and break them down into modules that can be added to other weapons

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Yeah, unfortunately, a couple of those would be borderline unusable. The robots aren’t vulnerable to hydrostatic shock, so hydroshock would just be a rarer hollowpoint. Subsonic would just be reduced ballistics against enemies that can already be pretty spongy if you don’t hit them “just so.”

The unfortunate thing is, the lack of wet targets mean a lot of ammo variants have to sit this out. If there was a second enemy type, (soldiers, hostile scavengers, or weirder stuff), that would open up a lot of rounds that we don’t really have a use for right now. Stuff like’s Dragon’s Breath, Hydroshock, Subsonic, ect. Even stuff like gas grenades would be useful.

Though, thinking about it, a WP round for the .50, possibly also an RPG shell, would be period appropriate and useful.

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Gentlemen, please, more damage towards machines is extremely bad…

Balance already is out the door… :frowning:

Agreed more damage to the robots isn’t needed careful placed shots can take the toasters down quickly


Xog, the apo machines are bullet sponges. We’re already in the arms race.


When 1st meeting and engaging a proto/military/FNIX tank, wasn’t it “bullet sponge” as well? Not because it’s HP but because lacking the know-how of taking one down the most efficient way.

Though, rather than increasing component HP, as devs have done it so far, i think components should all have same HP but it’s fixed how many components you need to destroy before machine blows up.

For example:
Currently, apo hunter has 90% of it’s HP in it’s cluster mortar. Shoot that bullet sponge off and few more shots are needed to blow it up.
Instead, how about the apo hunter won’t go down before 5x out of it’s 6x components are destroyed? The 6x being: flamethrower, mortar, 2x engines, back fuel tank and optics (head).
FNIX hunter would need 4x, military one 3x and proto one 2x components destroyed before blowing up.


It might be an unpopular view, but I think everything is all right with the robot HP.

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It’s not the HP, it’s their ‘intellect’ and virtually non-existent reaction speed that annoys me beyond anything.

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Yes, I’m much more efficient at killing the robots now that I know how to do it, but even if I play more careless spray and pray with the AG4 (not my preferred weapon by any means) I’m not having the same experience with regular or even FNIX robots that I have with the apocalypse machines.

Fair disclosure: I dislike the apo machines enough I rarely bother to fight them, and half the time if I meet them I’ll just quit the game and go and do something else instead. I’ve had zero fun with them. They’ve taken the bounce out of my bungee.

By bullet sponge, I’m referring to the mechanic where an enemy takes a lot of resources and time to destroy, while not changing their behaviours or offering much in the way of damage feedback in the process. Bullet sponges are a grind of the same simple loop over and over, and often give a disproportionately low reward for the effort invested. This is separate from my opinions about their weapons.

Things were different early in the game with poor weapons. Very early on I had a rusty 12G shotgun and I think birdshot. I was leaving Stenhaga farm heading for Mörtnäs, and I was on my way to the bridge. My encounter with the proto hunter was a case of hiding and being discovered, and I shot the hunter in panic and took it down ok. It was nothing like my experiences with my 5* weapons vs the apo hunters. Perhaps they feel bullet spongy because I’m not spamming the X-PVG-90 at them.

The first proto tank I met ate a lot of rockets and walked away. I thought it was almost mocking me, but now I know it was actually retreating. Later I probed for weak spots, figured out weapons, and had the battle. With the big robots the components become stages in the battle. I can shoot off the armour plates on the knees and I get feedback. I also open the core drive to attack, and I get the blue sparks. When that’s destroyed, I’m motivated to shoot at something else. There’s a change in the battle as components get knocked out.1 At lower levels with poorer equipment the tanks are tough, but the shape of the battle shifts a bit which keeps me engaged. With the apocalypse hunters I don’t get that feedback or change in a timely fashion, it’s a grind that’s suddenly over. I just get annoyed with them and feel my time is being wasted. The tanks are an even worse chore for that, even with their novel strategy of laying a mine field and trying to chase you into it with ticks.

I admit I didn’t know that 90% of the apo-hunter’s health was in its mortar. That’s bizarre and almost worse, I have a tiny target to shoot at in all the chaos. (Or I retreat really far and peck it to death slowly.)

1. I feel like this could have been a good opportunity for a kind of fps version of mmorpg world bosses in co-op, where the robot's behaviour would change to reflect the player's strategy as damage is applied and components damaged (such as nacking the knees to slow its movement or break the drive to hobble the turning circle allowing the players to out-manoeuvrer it). Hunters are a bit too small for that though, perhaps.

Amen @Flick!
I agree fully with what you said here.


Even then.

I actually have experienced this with harvesters, I think: shooting their knees seems to make them turn less quickly, or less deliberately. It gets easier to shoot them in the back.

Same with tanks, I believe, now that I think about it. At some point they tend to walk away exposing their back. Which you mentioned above.

I think this formulation is not fully correct. You can kill a hunter by taking off the mortar and add another X-PVG shot (roughly). But you can also kill the hunter while leaving the mortar fully intact.

It is rather that it is not a valid strategy to take off the mortar first. It won’t come off until the whole machine is basically done.

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With the coming of Plundra and folks just stashing ammo/explosives/whatnot we sadly need these bullet sponges.
Devs created a serious problem for balance, and it seems they want to use these to get rid of much.
Kind of like money sinks in games?

At least, that is how it feels to me…

The way the robots work is that they have a global health pool, and any shot to them will reduce this pool. The level of sparks implies a damage multiplier. Knocking out components removes their share from the health pool. It’s possible to destroy a tank by solely shooting it in the foot. Similarly destroying the fuel cells on the back of the harvester drop its global health significantly. So for the apo hunter, you’re not required to destroy the mortar, but it helps a lot if you do.


That is my understanding, yes.

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Some very nice and useful things to survive in GZ;))How U think?

Sure, when machines get miniguns and mini-nukes…

They are already equipped with 20mm auto cannons,cluster rockets and flamethrowers;)))

Which, if the above would be added, is no longer on par with it. XD

I don’t know if feasible but I would like to see bows in the game


Would that do anything in reality?
I mean…

Merely asking…
I am actually a compound bow nut myself. :stuck_out_tongue: