Hey guys,
We’re all passionate about GZ, but let’s agree to disagree and try to keep on topic. More in-depth discussion about specific game mechanics can be continued in another thread. #general-discussion is a much better place for that.
Cheers.
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Yeah, however that example is a better case for a non-harmful situation. You don’t, “spec into,” the Experimental 12 Gauge, it’s simply loot you find and equip it. Where as, the skill point you spend to pick up hacker, is gone. Your character is not permanently weakened (however minor) by getting an Experimental 12 gauge.
If the weapon system was it’s own skill tree, where you were buying weapons and equipment as you leveled up, then yeah, having niche weapons and no system to respec would definitely be a noob trap, because you gave up something viable for it, and couldn’t walk it back.
However, GenZero uses a normal loot system, so this mostly academic.
With that in mind, once you hit 31, you’re done. Any skills you picked up along the way are locked in, and the only way to change them is to start over with a new character, which is punitive.
Now, if they simply did away with the level limit, without altering anything else, that wouldn’t work; you’d end up far too powerful.
I’ve said it before, but I think the game would benefit from a limited number of active skill slots, similar to how the specialization work now. So, if you only had 6 skill slots, you would need to pick six skills to activate, and the other ones you owned would be, “turned off.” Another option would be a point system, where you can only activate 30 points worth of skills. While simultaneously, allowing players to level past 31, possibly until they filled out the entire skill menu, and could pick what they wanted to use on a whim.
Either way, right now, the level cap creates some serious problems, because it’s not announced. I mean, we had the discussion about Hacker not being clear, but that’s a problem with the level system itself, where, suddenly, without warning, you hit a ceiling, and if you don’t have enough skill points to finish the build you were working towards, you’re out of luck.
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Why 31.
I mean, it just bugs me why 31? It’s such a random number and random XP total.
Call of the Wild I’ve confirmed is capped at 40 so there must be plans for the bump. 30 I would understand nice even number, it’s kind of accepted that that’s it but 31…
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30 skill points, presumably. Still weird.
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There is a reason for that odd number.
When you make a new char, you start out at lvl 1. Leveling up to lvl 2 gives your 1st skill point. To get all 30 skill points, you end up at lvl 31.
To get a round number as lvl cap, char should start out at lvl 0 where 1st skill point is gained when leveling to lvl 1. Or when you start at lvl 1, you already have 1 skill point to spend.
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Ah, so the issue here is not the level at all.
It’s the skill points allocation that allows for the level to progress. So, in reality - the request should be for more skill points that would automatically increase the level cap by default.
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It would be nice if you could specialize with 1 type of weapon.
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First off thank you @AliasDJA for the link to this post. Second an idea for the level cap could be based around the exchange of a couple prestige points for 1 level increase for the experience bar to be filled or to buy a skill point to use as it would be a good way to get the skills a person would desire for a build if they branch out but want to play a certain way and if they want to get all skills or most the just have to do challenges for the prestige points to afford which as well in turn could enable the devs to add new skills to the game without effecting the players choice of skills and builds to do
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An idea for an increased level cap is the prestige points to be spent by having it be an amount that can vary for one level increase that adds to the maximum amount of levels or it could just get you one skill point?
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Reply merged into active topic on the same discussion + closure of old, inactive topic.
//Mod
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Why a level cap? Why is it impossible to get all skills? It’s kinda bad in a solo/co-op game. Especially when there’s no possibility to change the skills and there’s no warning when beginning the game about the limited skills points. I focused on more exp at first and I just found that we’re limited… It’s a bad move for End Game, because you level up faster, but it limits you at the end because your experience is limited. Kinda not very useful to spend 2 points for pointless experience because it’s not really worth it. Now I regret some skills I got, but I don’t want to lose the time spent and the gear if I restart the game. Making a new character it’s bad especially when playing with friends and without starting missions to level up fast.
If they still want to limit it, we should have kinda 2 kind of skills points:
- Useful skills
- Battle Skills
With useful unlimited and battle that are limited, so experience boost, bag and lockpick will not be a problem and solo will still have fun and in coop we will still have specialization.
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I personally like the fact that you have to choose your own playstyle and stick to it. For me, most of the skills that I couldn’t get because of missing skill points were skills that I didn’t want/need anyway. I got myself a nice, well balanced skill tree and don’t feel like I need more points in order to have fun playing.
It’s not like borderlands, where you’re supposed to be OP as hell with certain builds, but you can still be pretty strong if you spend your skillpoints wisely. I don’t think it needs to change, and I’m thrilled to see what they’re gonna do
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Your right, its all about balance.
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Unlike a lot of people, if they added more levels I’d be fine if they didn’t give you skill points upon completion. Instead, make the max cap way higher than it currently is, like 75 or 100, and make cosmetic rewards. This has 2 benefits:
-
Like titles you get from completing the challenges, obtaining cosmetics for levels would be a way to show your dedication. If someone has an outfit you get at level 100 for example, you’d know they were a good player.
-
It’s something to work towards. My biggest fear is that once I complete all the missions, I’ll eventually get bored. If they made the level cap higher and gave free rewards, that would at least be something for end game players to do.
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Same discussion topics merged.
//Mod
In one of the dev streams, it was asked to raise level cap to 100. Devs answer to that is at 00:45:14,
link: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/550826095?filter=archives&sort=time
There are cosmetic rewards in the game. You’ll get them once you complete the Challenge tasks.
Though, i’d like to see more added challenges with nice rewards, rather than flat out increase the level cap, even if you won’t get any additional skill points with it.
It doesn’t show that he/she is a good player. All what it shows is that he/she had time to grind to the lvl100.
That question was also asked in one of the dev streams. Devs answer to that is at 00:41:00,
link: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/554470149?filter=archives&sort=time
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The levels cap will never change. Came from Avalanche 3 weeks ago direct.
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While I respect your willingness to cite, I do really wish you’d abstract the relevant jist from those videos, especially for people who can’t open a Twitch VoD on a whim.
Or that the cheated their way to 100 by tweaking XP payouts via some method. Though, ultimately, all level based rewards in skill based games will ever indicate is that someone spent the time to grind it up, not that they were skilled.
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And how do you expect me to do that?
Also, you don’t need to have twitch account to view those videos. I don’t and i can see them just fine.
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Using words. For example: “The devs have said they’re not interested,” or, “they’re looking into it,” or “they’ve claimed that lizards are nesting in their hair.” You know, a quick response with the link, rather than just a link.
It’s less about not having a Twitch account, I’m quite active over there. Hell, I’ve got a stream running of someone I mod for open right now. It’s about not wanting to dig through hours of VoD by hand with a timecode, when a simple explanation would suffice. Also, it is inconvenient when I’m moderating for someone to then pull up an unrelated VoD and dig through it.
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How is this still discussed? The cap is there, so this doesn’t turn in to a power fantasy. You want ‘superpowers’ and you want them all, but this was a survival shooter. You shot to survive and now it’s turning to an action shooter with more demands to dumb down the game loop. There are people that modify the files in such ways.
I don’t think it was ever meant to be easy. The only way the levelcap demand can be justified is if the enemies become harder to kill as you go on and you become more dependent on your skill trees. This will ruin a solo, unless they choose an optimal build… and this is already turning in to a looter-shooter grind game discussion. Not to shy away from the fact that the game has become more looter-shooter grindy in it’s neccesity for ammo and XP, but the levels in the start never meant your own growth in understanding how to kill a machine depended on it… It’s been slowly turning in that direction and the difficulty implementation was a scuffed, but right step back. Simple sprint speed and lockpicking was useful enough, but not denying me from learning to play the game in decisions laid out in steps - tactics.
Keep it to requests, not demands. See what sticks and stop driving the game to the ground with already exhausted game formulas we’ve seen 1000x
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