it is not only based in the 80’s but has that theme with alot of the items and game play.
i think having you locked to a set so you have to make new class makes sense. i would think that each person needs to have just a few sets of skills not every be everything be superman. it is the 80’s where running from robots on a bike somehow made sense. just like having only one set of skills made sense.
i say leave it you can just make a new character super fast and level it up so you guys one for each situation depending on your team comp.
if anything a respec with some sort of cost would make sense, like something you have to raid for to get.
I thought that there could be something implemented where you could take back your skill points, but have earn them from the level you are at at the time, to use them again. Tis would also give the skills that gave you more xp more of a use, as you could change them faster, because when you hit level 31 those skills would become pointless, it could have been spent on something like less weapon sway, which you will use all the way through the game. This would also mean that people would not exploit it as if you could just take away skill points and put them strait onto another empty skill tree to make it full, as you switch on the go as an exploit.
I worked to get the ultimate skill that lets you get the robots to fight each other. On getting it, I find the percentage chance is so negligible and the chance of detection is too great. So for me, that skill is a waste and something I’ll never use in my “adventure mode” single-player play-through. I regret getting it, but had no idea of it’s limits.
I just found out the level cap will mean I’ll not be able to get the upgrades to health and durability I skipped to aim for this skill.
Those people promoting sticking to a “speciality” would still have this specialisation with no level cap, since you’d not be able to specialise in more than one ability, despite being levelled up in all of them, with levelled enough continuous play (I presume way past the end content of the game).
For players like me (who like the game but are crap at it), having no or low penalty skill point re-rolls would be a massive benefit, since it would encourage players to play in different styles without having to restart the game.
Alternatively, in my case I’d also be happy if the hacking skill was actually more useful.
I assume the new character would have no skill points, so you’d be playing the “saved” game half way through with starting weapons? That could seem to be worse than starting over, unless I’m thinking about this wrong!
When you say “situational”, what sort of situations would you describe? They’ve all been long range with multiple foes (so one attacks the other - or not) for me. Do you find they sometimes spot you from a mile off instead, when you try hacking sometimes? Unless I’m mistaken, it’s the reason why large groups of enemies have located me from miles away as I’m trying to thin them out by hacking. Would you agree a 10% chance of hacking means it won’t work 9 times out of 10?
Yes, unless you access your Plundra and take out the advanced gear you’ve collected so far since Plundra is also shared between your chars.
Example:
You’re pinned down inside a house by several hunters and without much ammo and/or first aid kits, your options are very limited. Hacking can be used to weaken the enemy until only one remains with less than full health.
I’ve done it several times when i 1st played GZ on my 1st char. While it took quite a bit of time (since there isn’t 100% chance success), it got the job done. Out of the three FNIX hunters who pinned me down, only one remained while other two were killed once i hacked them. And it took few rounds to end the last one since it wasn’t on full HP by then.
Yes. Also, only FNIX tank has 10% chance success rate. Other machines have higher success chance while Apo tank is worst, at 5% chance for success.
The idea of trying different classes by separating skill points per character, but sharing the same gear and world does not appeal to me at all: It would certainly make the same game harder, when I’m looking for the “adventure mode”.
You must be very patient waiting in the house. Given the actual percentage chances and cool-down timers, I’d have more luck with a few sticky flares. The way hacking is nobbled made it underwhelming for an “ultimate skill” to me. I still don’t quite see how the skill would be “situational” without extra examples and comparisons.
Why would you bother with a 5% chance - really? What are the chances of them spotting you though a hack, do you know? That aspect surprised me (if real and not just some “emergence” in my gameplay), since it’d turn the skill into a potential penalty instead!
I don’t play run & gun, i’m nowhere in hurry. Instead, i play sneak & snipe, thus, i have great deal of patience.
With hacking, machine will detect and aggro at you if it comes out of hack and it wasn’t aggrod before. However, if you’re already in combat then you can still hack machines and it’s there, where hacking is useful.
It’s best to use hacking against runners and hunters. Harvs and tanks have much smaller chance of success that it isn’t worth it. Also, it’s very easy to outrun harv/tank.
Another use for hacking is distracting machines, giving you a window for tactical retreat.
I, personally, don’t use flares/fireworks and to me, Hacking skill, that doesn’t take a spot in my inventory nor doesn’t have limited uses, was (and still is) better choice, despite it’s varying success rate.
I’m not sure I understand “machine will detect and aggro at you if it comes out of hack and it wasn’t aggro’d before” completely: I assume it means hacking can make machines spot you, but you don’t know the percentage chance of it.
In combat, I’d have to get the binoculars out and set them into a mode to hack, so that’s not particularly convenient in a firefight.
I understand why it’s best to aim hacks at the smaller machines - there is a fair chance (I think 50% and 33%) for a hack to work (not sure, but still does not work more often than it does for those machine types, plus the chance of getting spotted by the group). But that runs counter-intuitive to what a player would want from the skill, surely?
What do you do with all the fireworks you pick up? They don’t have a long cool-down, need aparatus to use and dozens can be carried.
I’m not sure if you’re playing devil’s advocate, or are just particularly happy with the way things are, but this isn’t productive dialogue for me in promoting change.
No. If you hack successfully any machine that wasn’t aggrod to you, it will be aggrod towards you once that specific machine comes out of hacked status 100% of times. It also instantly knows where you are and will start shooting towards you.
Look it as backwards trace by machine to locate whomever hacked it.
Thing is, i don’t pick any of them up.
While GZ can be improved on many ways, i don’t think removing the level cap (the original topic of this discussion) is something that benefits the game. Devs made GZ so where there is level cap and to test other skills, you’ll create new char. I’ve just accepted the way how GZ should be played, rather than advocating for it to be changed based on my own likening.
And i do like the added difficulty that came in April’s Update.
Like i said, Hacking skill is situational and niche skill, rather than overall skill that is useful everywhere (e.g Reload Speed).
If devs implement skill respec, you could remove the point or two from those skills and put them elsewhere but until that, you and i have them.
Didn’t say that. When loot table has all i need, i use Take All. If it has one item i don’t need while rest i need, i pick them up one by one. But since i don’t use flares as part of my tactics, i don’t pick them up. Just like i don’t pick up .32 FMJ (Möller) ammo if i see it in loot box (since i don’t carry that weapon).
Execution could’ve been better but i’ve seen far worse in my years and i’m not deterred by it in GZ.
I’ll just jump in from the first comments I’ve read. Lengthy, even for me…
I think it’s better to lock you out of perks if you choose another path. ‘Too OP’ or not, if you let the player unlock all skills, it becomes an arcade shooter. I don’t like that. Never really did and now with Guerrilla (still isn’t really in a good place) I feel much better to having prototypes be a threat to me. I’ve poured about 250 hours now and after starting fresh with Guerrilla on Archipelago, it all feels so familiar to my first time playing. I experienced that feeling of dread I had when I first started and I loved the game for the feeling. It’s back and I just fell in love with the game all over.
If the leveling’s perks were toned down to give variety and not a lot of edge over the AI machines, I’m in an agreement. If it’s going to be an arcade shooter, I wont see the point of the detailed world that is around you, if you zoom past it. At least - Archipelago. It’s new mapping and difficulty (plus no-hud mod) absolutely are this feeling that I want to capture more often. I take it slow, I take in the scenery more…
Maybe I can agree in fields of - Make leveling limited to perks that involve some combat twist, but make a separate branch to progress that doesn’t consume points for added inventory or stamina… Those are physical traits.
Like I said, I don’t see the situational aspect: Reload speed could also be situational, in that it’s only beneficial in a firefight too. Adding random chance to a perk working does not seem at all situational.
Just to clarify though, do you agree there is a chance of being spotted in the event of an unsuccessful hack from a mile away by a machine group?
I completely understand the mechanism: For me, looting sometimes has to be done quickly though (it’s situational), so picking up stuff I don’t want seems inevitable. For that reason, I find your negation of sticky flares unrealistic.
I wonder, do you think there is something wrong with the sticky flares, if you go to such lengths to avoid them? How could you include them more in your game-play? After all, the devs must have wanted their inclusion in the game. Why wouldn’t they work in a superior manner than hacking, for the situation you described earlier, where the machines were aggro’d to you in that house?
Another misunderstanding? I was referring to your response.
@UsernamePending While our discussion about Hacking and sticky flares, among other things can continue on, moderator in me can not let it continue in this topic. There are already quite a lot off-topic chatter already in here.
However, to continue our discussion, we would need to transfer it into PMs.
With respect, @Aesyle, there is very little in GenZero that you will not leap to the defense of. While it’s reassuring that you can find a use for the Hacking specialization, it does kinda illustrate both; why there needs to be more fluid systems to reconfigure our characters, and also that Hacking is a bit of a noob trap. (A system or build that appears viable, but is in fact non-functional or extremely limited.)
It is true that Hacking description doesn’t cover it’s limitations and people are expecting from it far more than they get.
Then again, when thinking a little, if Hacking would be exactly that what people think of it before knowing it’s limitations, it would be way OP specialization and do people really think that devs would put way OP specialization in the game while the rest of the skills give you slight advantage (e.g damage skill gives 5% or 10% damage boost, not 30% or 50% damage boost)?
There are other, niche skills/items in the game. Another one that comes into my mind is 6* 12G shotgun. While it has nice flechette ability, it’s range makes it very situational.
Or you can make a new topic in General Discussions subforum and post your questions there. Then i can join topic and we can discuss it further.
Alright folks, let’s end the off topic chatter now and keep the rest of the discussions on topic (level caps removal).
Since when topic gets way too derailed, it would end up in topic closure and i don’t like that to happen. (While i may not agree with level cap removals, there are a lot of people who do and this topic is vital to them.)
If you have further off topic replies to make, to reply to mine or someone else’s reply, send them a PM or make a new topic with your reply, like i suggested to @UsernamePending.
Ouch! I’ll have you know I think quite a bit. It was you that refused to explain your earlier position here though.
“OP” is a matter of opinion and I’d say a 100% working hack skill would not be OP at all, since machines don’t automatically get destroyed by it. Since you say it’s “situational”, how could you justify it being overpowered in all situations (especially with your quoted 5% chance)? The hack skill is woefully “UP” for me, so I don’t use it AT ALL - preferring the plentiful, fully working, no cool-down, no fail percentage flares instead, in cases where there is close combat.
This is an example of a skills load-out clearly not being advantaged by a lack of level cap and the huge imbalances and mysteries of the levelling system. Since (as you yourself say) this hack ultimate skill has “limitations” compared to player “expectations”. Compare this to the skill that revives you once per firefight, for example…
That’s the spirit! Maybe you as a forum moderator should not have been as needlessly dismissive of, and reactive to peoples’ concerns here. Then, there would not have been the problem in trying to get you to explain yourself.
