Machine AI (post december '20 update)


#1

I, and other players, have often suggested that the machines need a fine-tuning to their AI.
Pointing out that the AI that was “fixed” after the FNIX Rising update is faulty, shouldn’t come as a surprise to anybody, and I’m sure the devs also have AI fixes on their radar.

I have noticed a few things while playing after the december '20 update, though.
I’ve seen no one speak about it, nor any word about it in the patch notes, unless I missed it.

…so I wonder if this is just my imagination, or if a change in AI has taken place covertly?

The Hunter’s passiveness mid-combat has been my biggest grief, as I’ve clearly stated. However, after the update the Hunters seem to be just a bit more aggressive and more willing to engage the player in combat. Not sure how to elaborate further on what I mean, so I ask instead. Has anyone else noticed an increase in Hunter aggression?

Another thing I’ve noticed after the update is that Tanks almost never use their charge attack anymore. A few still initiate their charge like normal, most don’t. After I take out their weapons they just come stomping slowly after me. I let one FNIX Tank come close and he used his shockwave attack on me! Has something made them prefer this attack over their charge attack? Again I ask. Have Tanks stopped charging you as well?

Have you perhaps noticed anything else?

Could the devs secretly have made some changes?

And please, discuss how AI can be improved… :slight_smile:


#2

Funny, I thought to myself that hunters look more agile but had the feeling this was just my imagination. Now that you mentioned it I’m more convinced that the hunters don’t just stand there to wait to be finished that often anymore. It happens but quite rarely. Usually they run around the house I took cover and try to get a good angle. With 5-8 hunters around the house this has become quite the dance.

In addition I had quite a big fight at the Björntunet hotel (not the ridiculous defending mission, just a regular fight) with >>20 hunters and they warped inside the building extensively. I’ve never had it quite this time. I counted 13 hunters inside, 4 of them in room in the 2nd floor I couldn’t enter :sweat_smile:

I had not much fight with tanks due to the shortness of steel for ammo crafting but those which I engaged just stomped toward me slowly after I took out there weapons. No running attacks anymore.

And I have the feeling ticks try to enter buildings more then before. When a door is openend some come inside quite easily nowadays. But it could be my imagination as well.

I found the entering/glitching of the hunters inside the Björntunet hotel was quite a welcome change. Especially with Apocalypse hunter this fight was pretty intense and satisfying as well. (Although Benny complained about being stuck and doing nothing, just standing around and watching me run into the cellar being set on fire :rofl:).

If the change in behaviour for the hunter is implemented on purpose I congratulate the devs. The fights with hunters feel a bit more intense. The tanks could be more aggressive in my opinion. A FNIX tank is no big thread at the moment. The Apocalypse tanks are more of a nuisance with their constant rain of mines.
I’d like to have the AI of seekers refined. When they come in a group most of them just watch how their comrades are being destroyed. I’d love to see seeker fly in higher elevations having a broader field of view and therefore a larger area to spot the enemy.


#3

I also applaude the devs if they have in fact done some AI tweaks. :wink:

The Hunters aren’t quite “there” yet, but it’s definitely a step in the right direction. Hunters should be ruthless and relentless. Being caught out in the open by a pack of Hunters ought to be a death sentence 9 out of 10 times. Yet still they stand around and let you gun them down. Still their flechettes and railgun shots never hit you as long as you move. Still they don’t try to melee attack you unless you walk up and tap them on the forehead… It’s a bit embarrassing really, and I would love for the Hunters to actually become a respected and formidable enemy again, not cannon fodder.

Tanks… Never thought I’d say this, but I think Tanks need a touch of the infamous april ‘20 update!
They’re way too easy, and I won’t switch to Guerilla just to turn them into bullet sponges. That doesn’t help the issue. And I’ll argue that the Apocalypse class’ mine launcher was a mistake. (I respect the devs choices and I don’t like writing that word, but…) As long as you have some room to move around, no Tank of any class is really a threat. The Apoc Tank launcher should instead be a buffed version of the Apoc Hunters cluster mortars! Now that would be dangerous!


#4

There are plethora of topics in the forums, that have discussed the very same idea…


From the depths of forum, comes this idea of mine:

And to add to that:

  • Concussion Rifle - from lock-on to fire: 0.5 seconds (currently it is 4 seconds; after April '20 update, it was 0.1 - 0.2 seconds)
  • Cluster Mortar - doesn’t damage player through single layer of wall/ceiling (currently it does)
  • Seekers - after blowing the horn, machines should converge around the player (currently they converge around the seeker)
  • All machines - able to fire weapons while moving (currently, machine needs to stop to fire the weapon)
  • FNIX hunter and tank - they should deploy FNIX ticks (currently, they deploy military ticks. Only FNIX harv deploys FNIX ticks)

And that’s it for now.


#5

The hunters to me actually seem really lade-back and the tanks rely too much on missiles even at close range, I remember when I’d hide from tanks and all I’d hear would be STOMP STOMP STOMP STOMP but now when I get at least 200yds away they give up, they don’t even chase me anymore


#6

I have noticed as well that Hunters seem more to do: Jump strikes.

Their other actions seem the same, but I have not been pounced as much prior.

The Tanks REALLY need to close in on the players and have better close/mid range weapons. As it stands, their long range armament sucks. Missiles and mortars can be easily avoided and the machine gun has an accuracy of a Storm trooper.

Armament on the FNIX tanks should be:
Flame machine gun.
Shoulder mounted mortar.
Missile Barrage remains.
Gauss cannon on other shoulder.
Tactics:
Tries to stay in range of its remaining weapons if fired off.
Closes distance quickly to use weapons if players are out of range.

Apoc:
Flame thrower instead of machine gun.
Shoulder mounted mortar mines stays same.
Toxic Missile Barrage.
Gas attack.
Tactics:
Constantly tries to be close to player. If at distance will use its long range and constantly close in.

Military:
Machine gun.
Shoulder mounted mortar.
Missile Barrage remains.
Tactics:
Tries to stay at range of its weapons.
Closes distance quickly to use weapons if players are out of range.

Prototype:
Machine gun.
Missile Barrage.
Tactics:
Acts same as now.
Closes distance slowly.


#7

I, for example, liked that update, which many called the most terrible complex and everything in that spirit. only one thing was terrible - the hunter’s sniper rifle always hit. there tanks and reapers were worthy of respect)


#8

In all honesty it feels to me as if the machine AI almost turns off at a point.

A hand full of hunters can be a challenge; they flank, snipe, leap and deploy ticks.

However, get a couple of harvesters together and have them start to deploy hunters and you can quickly get 20 or more… at which point they become mindless. They pretty much run towards you, then stand around and look at you while deploying ticks. The ticks become more of an issue than the 20 hunters. You can see a glimpse of this here (along with a flying harvester).

Xbox Clip

The changes to the harvester are the most annoying. Gone is the nice animation for the “summoned” hunters arriving and they can repeatedly spam hunters at you without you killing off the first wave, resulting in bizarre “zombie” hunter behaviour described above.


#9

The missing animation for Hunter summoning is a confirmed glitch, is it not?
That means it will be fixed, like the Boo bridge. It’s not supposed to be like this.


#10

Topic here: Harvester behaviour